Large Hadron Collider (LHC) - Page 4

noaani · 12-08-2008, 06:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rinion

This experiment still has little to do with creationism vs evolution.

Imagine an old man walking in to his vegetable garden, only to find a great big hole in the middle of his tomato patch.
To one side of the hole is a man, next to him is a shovel.

The old mans neighbour tells him that she saw the man digging the hole. The old man thinks about this some, and decided to do a little investigation, just to be sure.

He inspects the side of the hole in the garden, and compares the markings there to the shovel. Since they are quite obviously a perfect match, the old man concludes that the man did not dig the hole, the shovel did.

In terms of the LHC vs creationism, all it is doing is trying to prove or disprove the method used.

Believer · 12-08-2008, 09:12 AM

here is another thought...

Why would we ever assume anything science suggests is beyond a sovereign god? While I personally don't prescribe to theistic evolution, or evolution at all, I don't even hesitate to say that anything is beyond God's ability to do.

LFJC · 01-01-2009, 05:45 AM

Personally I've always believed that God created the Universe - and that someday science may be able to decipher HOW he did it.

SoldierForJesus · 04-19-2009, 10:16 AM

Hold on guys. Proving the Big Bang could in no way disprove Christianity. Who`s to say that God didn`t use the Big Bang as a step in the creation process? It never said that he had to do anythibg else, did it? (if so, sorry, it`s been a while) Also, proving the Big Bang would only strengthen our beleifs if what I am saying is true. Right?

EaglesWings · 04-19-2009, 09:13 PM

I agree, SoldierForJesus. Here's the essence of science's statement about the Big Bang:

"Nothing exploded, and the universe came into being."

It seems to me that it takes more faith to deny an external First Cause (the action of an Eternal Creator) than to believe that it happened as a result of random chance.

SoldierForJesus · 04-20-2009, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EaglesWings

It seems to me that it takes more faith to deny an external First Cause (the action of an Eternal Creator) than to believe that it happened as a result of random chance.

What? The First Cause is the Nothing Exploded thing right? I'm a noob, so...

EaglesWings · 04-20-2009, 01:35 PM

The First Cause is what caused nothing to explode :-)

The concept of the First Cause (something which caused the universe, but was not itself caused) is the foundation of the cosmological argument for the existence of God. Basically, the way that it goes is, something caused the universe to exist, and this First Cause must be God.

Regarding the Big Bang, a specific version of this argument was created, which is called the "Kalam cosmological argument"

1. Whatever begins to exist has a cause.
2. The Universe began to exist. (at one point it did not exist, and then it did, this is the Big Bang)
3. Therefore, the Universe has a cause.

SoldierForJesus · 05-03-2009, 06:37 PM

Ok, thanks. I didn`t see anything in the Bible that says that nothing exploded. Again, if I missed something, tell me so I don`t look so stupid. Anyway, I didn`t see any proffet, sorryfor my spelling errors, or God say anything about how it came into being. In Genesis, all it said was "and the world came into being". I may be forgetting some of it though, we didn`t do our Sunday school lesson on Genesis

And we have not done one on it in a while now. Thats all I know, and I`ll look in the Bible for something to support my beleifs.

EaglesWings · 05-04-2009, 12:27 AM

You are correct in saying that the words (as well as the concept) of "nothing exploded" does not appear in the Bible, at least to my knowledge. As I stated in my earlier post, that is a basic encapsulation of science's statement about the creation of the universe.

The problem with science's statement is that they don't have any convincing explanation as to what actually caused the Big Bang to happen. We, however, have the clear statement of the Bible (expressed in many books of the Bible) that God is the origin, foundation, and sustainer of all creation. What we see in the Bible doesn't talk about exactly how the creation unfolded, probably because that didn't matter much to the authors and original readers. What mattered to them was that God created the world by His mighty Word...and the Bible is crystal clear on that, as you can easily find all throughout Scripture.

12-08-2008, 09:12 AM	#32 (permalink)
Believer Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 32 My Photos: (0)	Re: Large Hadron Collider (LHC) here is another thought... Why would we ever assume anything science suggests is beyond a sovereign god? While I personally don't prescribe to theistic evolution, or evolution at all, I don't even hesitate to say that anything is beyond God's ability to do.

01-01-2009, 05:45 AM	#33 (permalink)
LFJC Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 99 My Photos: (0)	Re: Large Hadron Collider (LHC) Personally I've always believed that God created the Universe - and that someday science may be able to decipher HOW he did it. __________________ *"Fossils came to exist during the flood. So did oil and all that. Dinosaurs lived with man, and were called dragons until the 1800s"* <--Fanatical Theory ,2008

04-19-2009, 10:16 AM	#34 (permalink)
SoldierForJesus Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 5 My Photos: (0)	Re: Large Hadron Collider (LHC) Hold on guys. Proving the Big Bang could in no way disprove Christianity. Who`s to say that God didn`t use the Big Bang as a step in the creation process? It never said that he had to do anythibg else, did it? (if so, sorry, it`s been a while) Also, proving the Big Bang would only strengthen our beleifs if what I am saying is true. Right?

04-19-2009, 09:13 PM	#35 (permalink)
EaglesWings Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 13 My Photos: (0)	Re: Large Hadron Collider (LHC) I agree, SoldierForJesus. Here's the essence of science's statement about the Big Bang: "Nothing exploded, and the universe came into being." It seems to me that it takes more faith to deny an external First Cause (the action of an Eternal Creator) than to believe that it happened as a result of random chance.

04-20-2009, 01:35 PM	#37 (permalink)
EaglesWings Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 13 My Photos: (0)	Re: Large Hadron Collider (LHC) The First Cause is what caused nothing to explode :-) The concept of the First Cause (something which caused the universe, but was not itself caused) is the foundation of the cosmological argument for the existence of God. Basically, the way that it goes is, something caused the universe to exist, and this First Cause must be God. Regarding the Big Bang, a specific version of this argument was created, which is called the "Kalam cosmological argument" 1. Whatever begins to exist has a cause. 2. The Universe began to exist. (at one point it did not exist, and then it did, this is the Big Bang) 3. Therefore, the Universe has a cause.

05-03-2009, 06:37 PM	#38 (permalink)
SoldierForJesus Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 5 My Photos: (0)	Re: Large Hadron Collider (LHC) Ok, thanks. I didn`t see anything in the Bible that says that nothing exploded. Again, if I missed something, tell me so I don`t look so stupid. Anyway, I didn`t see any proffet, sorryfor my spelling errors, or God say anything about how it came into being. In Genesis, all it said was "and the world came into being". I may be forgetting some of it though, we didn`t do our Sunday school lesson on Genesis And we have not done one on it in a while now. Thats all I know, and I`ll look in the Bible for something to support my beleifs.

05-04-2009, 12:27 AM	#39 (permalink)
EaglesWings Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 13 My Photos: (0)	Re: Large Hadron Collider (LHC) You are correct in saying that the words (as well as the concept) of "nothing exploded" does not appear in the Bible, at least to my knowledge. As I stated in my earlier post, that is a basic encapsulation of science's statement about the creation of the universe. The problem with science's statement is that they don't have any convincing explanation as to what actually caused the Big Bang to happen. We, however, have the clear statement of the Bible (expressed in many books of the Bible) that God is the origin, foundation, and sustainer of all creation. What we see in the Bible doesn't talk about exactly how the creation unfolded, probably because that didn't matter much to the authors and original readers. What mattered to them was that God created the world by His mighty Word...and the Bible is crystal clear on that, as you can easily find all throughout Scripture.